The Enterprise-D's maximum sublight velocity/acceleration.

[Who is like God arbour]

As for Relics, doing ~100 million KM in five minutes ain't gonna work sublight so that's not a very good example since it's widely established by characters in ST that impulse is in fact limited to speeds lower than light. And even the six minute estimate puts the acceleration to near-c as much worse than what was suggested earlier.

When and where was ever said, »that impulse is in fact limited to speeds lower than light«? I can't remember to have ever heard such a statement?

I admit, that I have assumed it too because it is impossible to reach light speed naturally. But if it was shown, that the Enterprise has covered a certain distance in a time less than light would have needed - without their warp-drive - we have to review our assumptions. Could it be possible, that the impulse drive, which operation principles was never explained - as the operation principles of the warp-drive was never explained - on screen - is able to propel a ship to velocities higher than light?

[Mike DiCenso]

Let us not forget that a Romulan BoPin the 23rd century appeared to travel at relatively low FTL on impulse power only.
-Mike

[Roondar]

As for Relics, doing ~100 million KM in five minutes ain't gonna work sublight so that's not a very good example since it's widely established by characters in ST that impulse is in fact limited to speeds lower than light. And even the six minute estimate puts the acceleration to near-c as much worse than what was suggested earlier.

When and where was ever said, »that impulse is in fact limited to speeds lower than light«? I can't remember to have ever heard such a statement?

I admit, that I have assumed it too because it is impossible to reach light speed naturally. But if it was shown, that the Enterprise has covered a certain distance in a time less than light would have needed - without their warp-drive - we have to review our assumptions. Could it be possible, that the impulse drive, which operation principles was never explained - as the operation principles of the warp-drive was never explained - on screen - is able to propel a ship to velocities higher than light?

Mr. Spock: Gas. Under impulse she expands fuel like any other vessel. We call it plasma, but whatever the Klingons call it, it's just ionized gas.
Lt. Uhura: The thing has to have a tailpipe.

Seems to me the operation principle was explained quite well - it's just a reaction drive which expands fuel to get thrust. This fits with how we see the drive flare up at higher thrusts and burst usage (per Booby Trap and other episodes). And before we start about mass lightening: the required energy to move any mass at speeds greater than light is still infinite. Even in Startrek ;)

Of course the vessels in startrek can in fact bypass that limit. By using their warp drive.

Another sollution for the alledged faster than light impulse speedrecords is to (like JMS suggested previously) take into account time dilation at higher speeds.

Neither option needs an FTL impulse drive, both fit the evidence and both are quite simple.

---

As to the Romulan impulse quote:
it's easy to see how you'd think that to mean they had no warp capability at all, but Scotty didn't state the Romulan didn't have a warp drive. He stated the ship was powered by the impulse drive ('their power is simple impulse'). It's quite conceivable to build a warpdrive that is powered not by a warpcore* like Starfleet uses but by the fusion reactor that is the basis of the impulse drive (and the most likely source of power used by Zefram Cochrane in his initial flight).

Considering the modern Romulan starships still don't use a matter/anti-matter core but instead use a quantum singularity to power their ship it's quite logical to assume they never used matter/antimatter reactors to power their warpdrive at all.

And Scotty was then very right to scoff at their powersource - Fusion is much less efficient than M/AM so the Enterprise was quite likely much more powerful as a result of the better generator.

*) And we know, thanks to Trip Tucker, that 'warpcore' was not factually the correct name for the device anyway, but the name stuck because it's primary use was (at least at first) to power the warpdrive.

[Roondar]

Something interesting I noted in the Voyager episode 'Tattoo'. The ship got caught during it's descent towards the planet and one of the options named to get back into orbit was going into low warp.

Now, setting aside the part where dumping large amounts of plasma into an atmosphere not being a good idea, the main reason the characters shot it down was because the inertial dampers where offline (which, on a sidenote, are a rather ingenious way to say 'screw you, physics!').

Tom Paris stated that this would not affect the ship as such, but it would kill everyone aboard, turning them into chunks stuck on the bulkheads (sorry I don't have the exact quote, the DVD is not in my house right now).

I wonder what kind of acceleration would be enough to have that* as an end result.

*) 'That' being humans turned into small chunks stuck on the back of the wall due to the intense acceleration.

[Mike DiCenso]

Here's the quote:


JANEWAY: It's not enough.

KIM: Could we go to low warp under these conditions?

PARIS: The ship might make it without inertial dampers, but we'd all just be stains on the back wall.


That's interesting, but it really doesn't tell us much about sublight acceleration, other than maybe it can be done without subjecting the crew to insane accelerations that would leave them as a greasy stain on the bulkheads. Given that humans have survived 40 g decelerations without serious injury, it would take at least hundreds of gees to do that, though even tens of gees applied in the right circumstances can be fatal. However, in this case, just turning a human body to jelly would likely require thousands, if not tens of thousands of gees, either slowly or in seconds.

This also isn't the first time where this has been an issue in Trek; In DS9's "The Ship", we learn that prior to it's crashing, a Jem'Hadar attack ship's inertial dampers had gone off-line, instantly killing the tougher than human Jem'Hadar crew and seriously injuring a Founder. In light of sublight deceleration, in VOY's "Timeless", the impact of the ship crashing without inertial dampers on a planet in an alternate timeline is sufficent to kill everyone onboard Voyager giving some idea of the forces that the dampers can be expected to protect the crew from.
-Mike

[Mike DiCenso]

By the way, Roondar, you might want to go to Chrissie's Transcript site for actual as-filmed dialog from the episodes rather than just rely on memory.
-Mike

[Roondar]

By the way, Roondar, you might want to go to Chrissie's Transcript site for actual as-filmed dialog from the episodes rather than just rely on memory.
-Mike

Now that is handy. I hadn't yet found one for Voyager see, I could only find scripts and the like for TNG, DS9 and Enterprise.

[Mike DiCenso]

What's nice about the site is that it will eventually include proper transcripts of DS9 once TNG is finished. Baring the odd spelling error, it should be the most accurate and complete transcribing of the actual as-spoken dialog from the TV series available.
-Mike

[Roondar]

Hmm, I'm wondering - are there other segments we can use to determine the STL performance of the E-D?

There must be a few 'straight line in a hurry' bit in the series somewhere ;)

Then again - a good question would also be why shouldn't they use their warp engines as an assist to cross in-system distances in a hurry. Seems to me it makes perfect sense, the system is apparently quite flexible and allows for even very small jumps.

[Mike DiCenso]

They have. In TOS' "Operation: Annihilate!" , the Enterprise chases at warp after a small ship heading straight in towards the Denevan sun. A similar thing is done in "Tomorrow is Yesterday", though it is to initiate the sling-shot time travel effect. In "Elaan of Troyius", it is strongly implied that the Enterprise could have used warp to traverse the Tellun star system in it's task to deliver the Dolman of Elaas to Troyius, but instead use impulse on slow speed in order to give the Troyian ambassador time to teach Elaan their customs.
-Mike

[Roondar]

Then again, in Inferno's light they where rather worried about having to use the warpdrive in system.

Which makes zero sense since they do it all the time (the E-D must have left planets from orbit only to go to warp immediately a hundred times - and vice versa, approached to a planet directly from warp as well)

It did work of course and managed to be one of the cooler effect shots in DS9 up till then, IMHO naturally. Maybe the problem was more the ridiculously small distance or the fact it was so close to the star?

[Mike DiCenso]

There are plenty of instances far too numerous to mention of starships warping in and out of a star system. It's the exception when they cannot do so, like in aforementioned "By Inferno's Light".

One of the more interesting cases of warping around a star system occurs in TNG's "The Schizoid Man" [Season 2] where the E-D performs a "touch and go" manuever to drop off an away team on a planet, then jump back into warp in order to save time and go rescue a stricken starship elsewhere.
-Mike

[Mith]

Then again, in Inferno's light they where rather worried about having to use the warpdrive in system.

Which makes zero sense since they do it all the time (the E-D must have left planets from orbit only to go to warp immediately a hundred times - and vice versa, approached to a planet directly from warp as well)

It did work of course and managed to be one of the cooler effect shots in DS9 up till then, IMHO naturally. Maybe the problem was more the ridiculously small distance or the fact it was so close to the star?

Well, if they do it too close to a star, tehy might get thrown back in time via the sling-shot method of time travel, but otherwise there is no reason why a ship shouldn't be able to go to warp. It may just be that this applies to certain areas, or laws within those specific systems.

[Mike DiCenso]

In ST:TMP, the Enterprise's warp drive was still untested, so it makes some sense that they held off on using it until they were well into the outer solar system.
-Mike

[Mith]

In ST:TMP, the Enterprise's warp drive was still untested, so it makes some sense that they held off on using it until they were well into the outer solar system.
-Mike

A good point, and it may also apply to systems that are unfamiliar to the UFP, and that it's simply a rule of thumb to drop out of warp because of that. Although why they did it in BoBW is a bit strange. I can see the Cube doing it out of a tactical point of not chargining into a well defended system, but the Enterprise D should have kept at warp. Although, Earth just may be one of those systems, or perhaps another reason might be attached to it (such as a paticular time or year, or area might be alright, but otherwise no).