Stupid things Trek/Wars debaters say.

[Kor_Dahar_Master]

This is recent but its still priceless:

"A small, one-man fighter should be able to penetrate the outer defense."

=


"Right, and a small, one-man fighter SHOULD be able to avoid the Superlaser. But it is also in no way a certainty."

A sb.com posters attempted justification for the Dodonna comment being about the superlaser.

Can I see the thread and where you got this from?

It started on this page:

http://forums.spacebattles.com/showthre ... ost6865232

[Mike DiCenso]

The easiest bit of evidence against the Dodonna quote refering to the superlaser comes straight up from the ANH novelization, chapter 11:

"Take special note of these emplacements. There's a heavy concentration of firepower on the latitudinal axes, was well as several dense circumpolar clusters."

This line from Dodonna occurs immediately after the infamous "firepower greater than half the starfleet" line.
-Mike

[Kor_Dahar_Master]

The easiest bit of evidence against the Dodonna quote refering to the superlaser comes straight up from the ANH novelization, chapter 11:

"Take special note of these emplacements. There's a heavy concentration of firepower on the latitudinal axes, was well as several dense circumpolar clusters."

This line from Dodonna occurs immediately after the infamous "firepower greater than half the starfleet" line.
-Mike

It was in a movie only thread.

[Mike DiCenso]

I wouldn't have guessed that from reading that thread. But you can still argue the visuals stylistically in both movies and TCW are intended to resemble the air battles of WW-II. Also where this thread is concerned, the ANH novelization is perfectly reasonable to draw upon for evidence.
-Mike

[Picard]

E-E wasn't "fully shielded", it's shields were already down to an unspecified %. That wing probably imparted kiloton of KE at shields at most; that is not even 1 millionth of what E-E's shields should be capable of tanking. On the other hand, I vaguely remember some evidence that Star Trek shields do not handle kinetic impacts very well (passing throught asteroid field in one TNG episode).

[Lucky]

"But our shields are gravitation-based, so no weapon can even hope to hit our vessels, no matter the fact that objects have hit our fully shielded crafts before!"

Really?
So asteroids are graviton based now?

When are working ships threatened by mundane space junk that at least isn't a large fraction of the ships mass or more? I admit having to not seen every episode and movie in Star Trek. The two times ships were threatened that come to mind involve the navigational deflectors not working at the time.

How to do you know what the asteroids were made from? It's actually not uncommon for Astroids in Star Trek to have large amount of exotic materials in them.

The Romulan ship wing in NEM that hit the fully shielded E-E was graviton based?

Why should we assume this was not shields VS shields?

By design the navigational deflector has to move everything out of the way of the ship from asteroids to the smallest subatomic particle, or bad stuff at least should happen to the ship and crew, and turning on the shields has had the effect of making ships invisible as part of the plot. Anything that contradicts those facts is in fact the outlier since that is what the navigational deflector and shields do in the vast majority of episodes.

[Lucky]

10. Imperial power is based on hypermatter not fusion (reality: it isn't)

The Death Star was 120 kilometers in diameter. Much of its interior space was devoted to systems required to maintain its massive superlaser and power plant. At the heart of the Death Star is a gigantic hypermatter reactor. Within this chamber burned a fusion reaction of prodigious proportions, fed by stellar fuel bottles lining its periphery.

One could take this to mean they incorporate a derivative of hyper-drive technology into their fusion reactors.

The same page listed the diameter of the Death Star as both 120 and 160 kilometers.^_^

[Lucky]

The polaron is a real particle. It's an electron with an accompanying polarization field.

You are a little off on what a polaron is. They are quasi particles.
http://physics.ucsc.edu/~bridges/simula ... 2_700.html

And shield modulation is measured in MegaHertz. Which seems to indicate that photons make up some component of deflector shields.

Hertz is simply the SI unit of frequency defined as the number of cycles per second of a periodic phenomenon. We don't know what they are measuring. For all we know they could be measuring the vibrations of the quantum strings.

Screen cap of said display with the information.
http://www.st-v-sw.net/images/Trek/Movi ... ni0369.jpg

Read this
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hertz

We never see anything like that in ST.

The Federation uses phasers at warp, and warp field only extend a few meters from the hull. That means phasers must be Faster then Light.

A similar argument can be made for Photon Torpedos since they are also fired at warp, and are shown to accelerate after leaving the warp field.

[Praeothmin]

E-E wasn't "fully shielded", it's shields were already down to an unspecified %. That wing probably imparted kiloton of KE at shields at most; that is not even 1 millionth of what E-E's shields should be capable of tanking. On the other hand, I vaguely remember some evidence that Star Trek shields do not handle kinetic impacts very well (passing throught asteroid field in one TNG episode).

Fully shielded or not, my point still stands: The E-E was shielded, and a non exotic piece of metal impacted it...
So no super black-hole shielding for ST...

[Picard]

I am saying that drop in shield percentage was probably completely unrelated to that peace of metal. As for black hole shields, yes and no - Federation shields are gravitational distortion, as are black holes, but that is where similarities end.

[Admiral Breetai]

The Borg can't adapt to life force so any character with flashy qui type stuff can easily kill them.

It's a theory I invented in relation to Borg vessels against massive attacks..but some asshole on either SDN or SB took it and exaggerated it to levels beyond imagination

[mojo]

how about the theory that star wars characters are completely unable to fire a gun accurately at certain other star wars characters because inbreeding has become so rampant that it's impossible to know whether or not you may be firing upon a family member? that's a pretty stupid idea.. isn't it?

i've also heard the theory presented that certain warsie debaters who may or may not frequent this board are completely unable to concede even the most trivial point because their entire self image is wrapped up in total worship of the leaders of the hardcore warsie contingent, so much so that acknowledgment of an error on the part of those leaders or their arguments would cause a loss of faith so immense that a complete reevaluation of their lives and beliefs would be inevitable and catastrophic. dumb, right?

and then there's the theory that true debate on some sw/st boards has become so rare that entire communities ignore this flaw and the absolute pointlessness of debate with a person of such a mindset. duuuuuuumb.

what about the hilariously stupid idea that a mod would claim that cleaning up a nine post prank on a member that the entire board recognized as a troll took up his full attention for days and somehow stopped him from banning the troll. the issue is not whether or not the prank was right/wrong or worth the subsequent banning, but that ridiculous claim. and though a mod is never required to explain his actions, it seems like loud and repeated requests for the truth of how that claim makes any sense would provoke the mod to give some sort of explanation even if only to rid himself of the irritation. what the?!

[Lucky]

E-E wasn't "fully shielded", it's shields were already down to an unspecified %. That wing probably imparted kiloton of KE at shields at most; that is not even 1 millionth of what E-E's shields should be capable of tanking. On the other hand, I vaguely remember some evidence that Star Trek shields do not handle kinetic impacts very well (passing throught asteroid field in one TNG episode).

Fully shielded or not, my point still stands: The E-E was shielded, and a non exotic piece of metal impacted it...

The navigational deflector should have stopped that tiny peace of hull since we've seen them stop worse in the "Year of Hell in Voyager".

Hulls from ships are made from exotic materials, and may not even be made of baryons.

Starship Mine
"Captain's log, stardate 46682.4. The Enterprise is docked at the Remmler Array where it will undergo a routine procedure to eliminate accumulated baryon particles. In preparation for the sweep, we are evacuating the ship."

So no super black-hole shielding for ST...

Given that other ships classes like the Galaxy class, Constitution class, and Intrepid class can bend electromagnetic radiation around the ship there is something off about the scene unless the Sovereign-class has drastically different, and seemingly less effective shields.

[Praeothmin]

Given that other ships classes like the Galaxy class, Constitution class, and Intrepid class can bend electromagnetic radiation around the ship there is something off about the scene unless the Sovereign-class has drastically different, and seemingly less effective shields.

Well, since they don't bend all types of electromagnetic radiations, since we see them (light isn't bent), then I'd say the scene is fine as we see it, and that only the black-hole interpretation of ST shields has flaws...

[Kor_Dahar_Master]

I am saying that drop in shield percentage was probably completely unrelated to that peace of metal. As for black hole shields, yes and no - Federation shields are gravitational distortion, as are black holes, but that is where similarities end.

Voyager did sit inside the event horizon of a singularity for quite some time. :D

PS: Add the writer who decided that event would make a good episode to the list along with the dude from the warp 10 episode.